Curse

Sk8tborderx · May 19, 2006, 05:38 AM // 05:38

I have never heard or read anything from ANET saying it isn't working how they want.

If you want to own a town you need faction, to get faction you need to farm, so it is time>skill until they change it. Prophecies has a system that is skill>time and it is called favor, everyone had a problem with that also. People will just never be happy until they can have acess to all the high end content at all times without having to do anything for it. People hated the fact that PvP determined what you could do in PvE, the only way to make PvE determine what you can do or what you can acess is farming, or making you have to complete certain things to gain acess. (Most likely farming which is still time>skill).

I am sure ANET is making an alternative method to get into the elite missions because it is a very poor system that we have right now.

Either way it is not a flawed system, just a bad system.

Hunter Sharparrow · May 19, 2006, 10:15 AM // 10:15

Quote:

If you want to own a town you need faction, to get faction you need to farm, so it is time>skill until they change it. Prophecies has a system that is skill>time and it is called favor, everyone had a problem with that also.

Not the same problem. PvP and PvE should not have such an influence on each other. In the favor system it was PvP that allowed people access to the PvE content and what did PvE restrict in PvP? Unlocking? If that was it than there were different ways to unlock stuff and once unlocked it stays unlocked. So for the favor system you had PvP controlling PvE content but not the otherway around.

In the current system the largest problem is how faction is aquired. Through farming. Yes we could try and join one of the alliances but the key word there is try. We could also try getting enough faction ourselves but I know for my guild we don't have nearly enough people and even less that play on a regular basis. It puts too much control into the hands of other players no matter how you look at it. It also doesn't test one's skill at all.

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People will just never be happy until they can have acess to all the high end content at all times without having to do anything for it.

I'm really getting sick of people throwing out this hollow argument. If you actually read what people are saying all have leaned toward an alternative way to gain access and not just have access to it the moment they reach it. An alternative way that actually tests an individual's or alliance's skill at the game.

Quote:

People hated the fact that PvP determined what you could do in PvE, the only way to make PvE determine what you can do or what you can acess is farming, or making you have to complete certain things to gain acess. (Most likely farming which is still time>skill).

There are many ways PvE can determine what you can access. Chalange an NPC in a duel, do a prerequisite quest(s), gain specific title(s), and I'm sure there are more. Not only did anet claim that farming is not required but they have also gone through great lengths to put a stop to it. The current system allowes farming for faction the best way to aquire it.

Quote:

I am sure ANET is making an alternative method to get into the elite missions because it is a very poor system that we have right now.

Either way it is not a flawed system, just a bad system.

Are they adding an alternate means of access or are they changing the current system completely? The change will take a few months (2 or 3) to make which indicates to me that they are changing the current system. So if they are making changes to the current system, why would they do this if it wasn't flawed?

NinjaKai · May 19, 2006, 10:20 AM // 10:20

If you both wish to get technical. The system isn't flawed in that there is a bug with it. It is the initial concept they chose when making it that was flawed. This is what made it a bad system. So technically your both right.

Jagflame · May 19, 2006, 11:40 AM // 11:40

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PvP and PvE should not have such an influence on each other.

I disagree, but this is not the thread for this discussion.

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If you actually read what people are saying all have leaned toward an alternative way to gain access and not just have access to it the moment they reach it.

Please read the topic. The main idea in this thread is having free access to all.

WasAGuest · May 19, 2006, 12:45 PM // 12:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagflame

I disagree, but this is not the thread for this discussion.

I agree with Hunter here, PvP should have nothing to do with PvE content and vice versa. If Anet still thinks merging the two play styles is a good idea, then linking the too via meta games that are not required to progress, unlock, gain access or aquire is the only way to go. This makes the annoying (to me) PvP rushed games optional.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagflame

Please read the topic. The main idea in this thread is having free access to all.

Subject line says "Elite Mission Available to All ?" doesn't say anything about free access. The idea of "free" access, from reading back, came from someone not wanting to give access to everyone and thier argument that "elite missions shouldn't be 'free'".
Those of us wanting to have alternate access were requesting a system in which to unlock the missions via quests, missions or a way in which does not require yet more farming (ie, paying gold or faction).
We are also requesting a system that doesn't limit access once it's opened, like the horrible favor system. It's horrible in that any player from one moment to the next can not plan for or plan with a group/guild to go to these places. Thus, for example, on Wednesday night the group plans a get together for Friday night to go to FoW. They log in, find they don't have favor and now thier plans are gone to pot. The dumbest argument that always follows that is "well, they could go win HoH and then go". This is always countered by common since. If they logged into play FoW, that's what they wanted to do. Not go "work" for what they should be able to play. Second, they may not like PvP and don't want to "waste" their evening. Third, if the group spends the time winning HoH, they are now out of time and have no time to go to FoW and enjoy the evening they planned on.
If Anet puts a similar system in play for these Elite Missions, then we will be back here again really ticked off cause they are obviosly not listening or reading these forums.

If we like the idea posted about weapons and skills being rewarded as "loaner" items that are held for as long as the city is held, speak up and I'll go post it in Sanitarium. Now's the time to suggest such things before Anet dorks the system with more farming or favor options.

Sneaky Dante · May 19, 2006, 03:03 PM // 15:03

Well the TC alliance is currently just ferrying everyone into the deep.. with often not even a ty. We worked hard for the control of this city and we just let everyone in but people are starting to act like its a normal mission. They are lf ferry's its not about us coming to them they come to us now... If you ran them into the deep and want to play some you often cant join a team which is full of non alliance members... I have NO problem running those people into the deep... but its getting too normal for some people who dont even say ty or what ever...

As for the people who want it open always.. that would punish us than.. I know we are smaller than the total GW community but we did *work* for this city and we are ferrying people into the mission.. and I realy dont have problems doing that... but we did work for that city and since we ferry people in now it is kind of open for all...

Jagflame · May 19, 2006, 09:51 PM // 21:51

Quote:

Subject line says "Elite Mission Available to All ?" doesn't say anything about free access. The idea of "free" access, from reading back, came from someone not wanting to give access to everyone and thier argument that "elite missions shouldn't be 'free'".

Hmm... I don't believe that's how it went. Here's the first two sentences:

Quote:

What if... the current alliance that held Cavalon was overthrown and the alliance that overthrew them opened up the elite mission to all? Wouldn't that be nice ?

To me this sounds like free access to all. Free access to all is also what TC is giving right now, which is, to me, the main subject of the thread.

Jeebus 07 · May 20, 2006, 06:01 AM // 06:01

Well I must thank the TC Alliance for taking me into the Deep it is very much appriated, thanks again.

WasAGuest · May 20, 2006, 06:23 AM // 06:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagflame

To me this sounds like free access to all. Free access to all is also what TC is giving right now, which is, to me, the main subject of the thread.

Eh, just a matter of view then. I don't see it that way.

As for the TC ferries, that's nice of you. Look at it this way though: Anet's design is punishing those not in your alliance by not having the opportunity to go there on our own "earned" way. We have to rely on others to get there. To me, that's not fun, and is no different then me asking TC for the drops you get there (if that's what I was going there for), and all the gold, exp and fun (ie, content) to just be handed to me.
If, once again, the idea of joining TC or another guild comes to mind, read back and see the reasons why.
The player base is not asking for TC to be punished, Anet's design is doing that to you. I would suggest TC (and other guilds) come up with an alternate reward system. Especially one that does not restrict play for others.

Engel the Fallen · May 20, 2006, 08:23 AM // 08:23

To me this is cut and dry horrid game design.

Fighting is out of hand in Cavalon now and members of a certain alliance will flame people for even mentioning TC. People in forums are pist off that areas are in the game, but unless they major sacrfices to how they play the game and even real life shit in some cases they can never access them. Finally, as mentioned this goes totally against anything ANET stood for before in terms of farming and time, as well as against the what we assumed factions would be about in terms of faction vs faction.

I say just get rid of these stupid elite areas all together. I mean when you played a game like Super Mario World did the game ever make you feel unworthy to access the secret elite area [star world]? Did you ever have to wait days or weeks to access a bonus mode in say Resident Evil 4 because guys a few states away did not do a certain part of the game a certain way?

No and it would be absurd to even think that there would be areas in games that a player has almost no control over getting access to. All the elite areas in this game force players to become so specialized in one area that more often than not they do not really get to spend time in the very elite areas they opened up to others. Why not allow the people who wish to access these areas do so themselves? Make players donate 100k on there account then give them unlimited access to the elite mission of the side they donated that faction to. Do something similair to UW and FoW in Tyria. It does not have to be easy, but should be possible so that anyone with enough time can do it with henchies or PuGs. You should not have to rely on luck as is the case often with winning HoH or leaving your guild to join some specialized guild just to access some high end areas. Also if you are a PvE player you should not be expected to join a PvP guild and grind away at PvP just to be able to get into some high level PvE areas.

However, ANET seems dead set in alienating massive amounts of people from areas of the game. I pity those in Taiwon or Japan who have to swap to European or American servers just to enter FoW or UW, and the people who have to suck up or buy there way into the Kurzick mission. I assume chapter 3 will contain some equally dumb way to gain access to the high level content there. But by then people will learn that this game basically is charging a monthy fee as it rushes out content and will be more likely to leave for a real MMOPRG that will cast about the same price in the long run and ultimately offer far more.

jean1190 · May 20, 2006, 12:04 PM // 12:04

I just want to let you know that "Bomberboys orKs" ally is owning the House zu Heltzer since yesterday.

We are doing same thing than The Crusaders for Cavalon. Free taxi to the Urgoz Warren!

You are ALL welcome!

Go to HzH district french1 or english1 ( prefer fr1, we are from france... so... )

Have fun

Sir_BlackJack · May 23, 2006, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Any news from Anets side on this topic ?

Shanaeri Rynale · May 23, 2006, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Quote:

We are doing same thing than The Crusaders for Cavalon. Free taxi to the Urgoz Warren!

I know, massive huge thanks for doing this. I know people are very appreciative of all the hard work and effort you guys have put in
Vive La France.

WasAGuest · May 23, 2006, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir_BlackJack

Any news from Anets side on this topic ?

Yup. Here.

Sir_BlackJack · May 23, 2006, 08:45 PM // 20:45

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We will make changes that allow a player to access all missions in both lands, yes. ETA - a few weeks.

Thank god finally.

PS:
Does this include the "presear" missions ?

WasAGuest · May 23, 2006, 09:35 PM // 21:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir_BlackJack

Thank god finally.

PS:
Does this include the "presear" missions ?

My understanding is that Proph presear is still a no go (since the world is toast and all), but the Factions "noob" isle will be all opened (since the areas there have mission explorable zones).

Pandora's box · May 25, 2006, 06:51 PM // 18:51

So whats the ferry plan until Arenanet makes those missions available? Ferries for the weekends?

Hunter Sharparrow · May 25, 2006, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Does this include the "presear" missions ?

Presear doesn't have any missions just quests.

Sir_BlackJack · May 25, 2006, 10:20 PM // 22:20

I was refering to the mission on cantha which are locked for tryians and the missions before LA.

You can't play the first mission in Cantha as Tyrian. In my opinion this is presear of cantha.

Still thanks for your insightful answer.

Bock · May 15, 2007, 09:44 PM // 21:44

Well I think you can all look back now..those who bitched about TC opening the deep..... Im pretty sure we have had 2 or so events where those ELITE missions are open to EVERYONE

I know, this thread was over a year ago, i joined a guild who was involved with this and had to take a look at this thread.